Saturday, December 8, 2012


It was comforting to hear of this outcome. It was encouraging to know that the Sarawak Natives were able together with lawmakers in Australia and Tasmania were able to convince Hydro Tasmania to retreat from their enthusiastic support of Taib’s land grab. In similar vein, the Anti Lynas activists must be applauded for their forays into Australia, on their own steam, to voice their plight.
Less talk and more action that is.

Back home the issue is: Will there be a smooth transition resulting from the choice the people make after GE13. What would both sides react? 

If three of us, Commander Thaya, Zaid Ibrahim and I have independently posted on this subject it is because we feel strongly about the aftermath of GE13 and thus is a pressing issue.
Zaid Ibrahim wrote:                                   
Judging by the speeches and statements of the party’s leaders, they will not. The Prime Minister himself announced that Putrajaya will be defended at all costs. UMNO leaders have described Anwar Ibrahim as an agent of foreign powers, sometimes even as an agent of the Jews. They warn that calamity awaits us all if the Opposition wins, in the form of national bankruptcy or even the recurrence of racial rioting. Can we trust such leaders to voluntarily and graciously hand over power to Anwar?
When the Barisan Nasional lost its two-thirds majority in 2008, the country was fortunate that we then had a Prime Minister who was a gentleman. Despite being pressured and humiliated by all quarters, Pak Lah made a statement well past midnight on that fateful day that saved us from harm. He said the Government must accept the people’s decision, and he left no doubt in anyone’s mind that the security of the country would not be compromised by the outcome of the General Election of that year.
He has more HERE.

Thaya’s earlier piece In Defence Of Our Realm, he volunteered that the most common question people who read his comment pieces ask is: "Which side will the armed forces take?"

All this Umno ‘war talk' of late naturally leads to the question of the role of the Malaysian Armed Forces in the event of a repeat of a ‘May 13' scenario, which Umno foresees will occur if BN loses federal power.
As reported in Bernama in 2004, former Air Force chief General Abdullah Ahmad said that officers and men of the RMAF should not bite the hands that feeds them. Quote - "We can analyse the situation ourselves. Are we that unreasonable and are we that ungrateful to oppose the government that provides us our livelihood?" he said.
However, blogger Brigadier General (Rtd) Mohd Arshad Ragi who blogs in Mind No Evil asserts HERE: "I am firmly against the use of the military, and they ought to be steadfast in remaining neutral.”
"The military today is not geared nor equipped for public order. In the days gone by, we even had a camera to be used for public order in the ‘equipment table' in all infantry units. Today, that item is out, and along with it, the gas mask, the stretcher and the banner. Even the Public Order Manual is today a museum piece."

In my earlier piece HERE I urged the think tanks to address this. I have said that this is no time to pussy foot around this issue when Najib himself said that at all cost they will not allow PutraJaya to be in opposition hands and then at the UMNO Assembly, the Cow Matriarch warned of an impending repeat of May 13. This is a serious threat! But the PDRM and the Home Ministry, always sensitive to seditious talk, arresting us for holding lighted candles, at one time for wearing black, for  protesting against 800 odd custodial deaths, has not even raised a whimper over such threats of pandemonium from UMNO. For sure we the rakyat cannot depend on them to protect us should chaos occur. As such we depend on the King and his Armed Forces to protect us and the country from sinking into anarchy. But will they. We can only get an assurance if they can publicly declare that they will stand by us. They can only do this at a public forum. Maybe the  rejuvenated and resurrected Paper that Cares might take up this dare…..only if it really DECLARES that it CARES. How about it Malay Mail?
In the meantime, like Zaid requested, the Opposition should spend more time assuring the rakyat that they too must assure us that they have in place a mechanism to forestall anarchy. They owe THIS to the people who  are determined to escort them into PutraJaya. As such, the opposition should not waste too much effort on pusillanimous pricks like Chua Tee Yong who until today cannot utter a word of defence on the costly bovine  blunder conceived and gestated by his Ministry.
How about it Malay Mail, are you up to Caring?.......
or must the ORDERS still come from upstairs?
If that BE the case


Anonymous said...

Dear Zorro, out of curiosity, what happened to BG Mohd Arshad Ragi?

Tok Rojak

zorro said...

Tok Rojak, we have communicated with BG. He will resume blogging the moment GE13 is announced.

Ellese said...

Fear mongering. What about if PR looses? Can we have peace. No demonstration and chaos.

Both parties must agree to accept the election results. Once you submit to the election process both must accept it. Right now we get stupid statements like this.

Before asking others of peaceful acceptance of election results, please put a stand you do similar. Otherwise another hypocritical statement by politicians and blind partisan goon followers.

zorro said...

Ellese, do read the link to Zaid's posting that I provided. He wrote: On behalf of the Opposition, Anwar should make a similar statement pledging to accept the people’s choice in the elections graciously, regardless of the outcome. Such an affirmation will put some pressure on the Prime Minister to do the same. If the Prime Minister does not reciprocate the gesture, then the people will know that the election results may not be honoured. They should then take all necessary countermeasures to ensure such an event does not take place.
I am rather surprised at you being so slipshod.

Conned said...

Let your next post be on this absurdity - AELB says will hold Lynas pledge to export the waste from the LAMP plant but today its Managing Director Marshal said the waste cannot be exported as according to International Convention, TOXIC waste cannot be exported to other country

backStreetGluttons said...

We wouldn't put our money on wishy washy Zaid and for that matter the exclusively pampered Royals or the dubious unknowns in charge of da Malaysian Military, & definitely not that spineless scary Zahid fellow

Jong said...

The Cow Matriarch planning a stampede and warn of impending repeat of May 13?
She better pray all goes well otherwise we Rakyat Malaysia will hold her to it, this is serious threat!

Tak malu perempuan!

Another Anak Bangsa Malaysia said...


I have never commented on your blog but have followed it for a while :)

Firstly, please do get well soon as we need more people like you. If writing will help you get better quicker, by all means, pls write, otherwise, just kick back and relax and let others carry the load for you for a while :)

On the other hand, it might not be easy to keep a tough ole bastard like you tied down at all. You'd probably struggle too hard to get a decent grip on :)

Re the situation after GE13, it is worrying.

One point to note is that not ALL in PDRM are against the rakyat and not ALL in the Defence forces are for the rakyat.

Another point to note is that the Agong may like to give his views on what he wants for the nation after GE13.

After all, the Sultan of Selangor has already given some of his views on where he stands in relation to political matters and it is quite clear, to me at least, that the Sultan has come down on the side of his subjects in Selangor.

I am not sure what the answer is to sideline the miscreants in PDRM and the Defence forces but sidelined they must be. Perhaps, those who are in command of various units could be vetted for integrity - I dunno :)

P.S. I notice a commentator named Ellese here as well, so this bit is for Ellese - yes, we are following you around and we are watching you :)

P.S.S. If Ellese believes that bit about me following him/her around, I have also got a bridge to sell him/her for scrap metal as well. Heheheheheh!!

Pls see the following link, Ellese :-

passion1 said...

The fact that BN do not welcome international observers, do ring a bell.
This election is too tense to be taken for granted, need to have international press, or even UN Peace Keepers.
Meanwhile, to BN I would ask, 'Why can't accept losing like a gentlemen? The rakyat have rejected you. So be it.Haven you read,'Dare to Fail', by Billy Lim?
If you can change and improve the livelihood of the rakyat, we will vote you back,with all new faces.

Ellese said...

Then my hats off to you. If you hold on to this and ask your blog follower to do this, then due respect must be accorded. Then my claim against you is way off and will be retracted.

What this means is that we must all agree to accept the election result however much we don't like it. If bn loses they must not resort to the use of force. If PR loses they must not resort to street protest. If there is any unhappiness, both must agree to resolve this through courts. No change of government by other illegal means. Once we follow the Thais be it militarily or by street protest ala Arab spring, we can no longer moved ahead in unison. We will be bogged down by gridlock insensical politics. Our children who will suffer.

Many must realise our electoral system is in the mains very fair and transparent. In any process there must be room to object and here is where we have plenty. Whatevers flaw can be overcome by understanding. And in this when I hear and read that our election process is wholly tainted, this is a very dangerous line of argument. You may not realise this but many are blind followers. The push to say PR is going to win and then to spread the news of manipulation election by will create a huge expectation among them.When not met people become angry. This will lead to other irreversible damage.

I've Just read DAP position on this issue and its a highly commendable one. Though it should say that it won't bring the change of government by the street, it's acceptable to me. Now PAS and PKR especially Anwar must follow up. On the other side, BN must say they will not use force and accept the electoral results.

passion1 said...

That Air Force chief was not qualified for the job.We are lucky that we did not go to war during his time.He would have sold secrets to the enemy, for a reward, and his freedom.
Cannot imagine our Malaysian army,willing to kill fellow Malaysians.
Its happening now in Syria. No?

Pak Lah is the kinder PM, but he has to go, because Khairy is in the way of Mukhriz, our future MB of Kedah.

zorro said...

Ellese, thanks for the feedback. Since I blogged in 2007 I have been invited to join the opposition. I prefer not too because I can be more effective not taking sides. This way I am free to "whack" any missteps by any party. I have good friends on both sides who understand my stand and we remain good friends and sharing.

Ellese, I have been through 2008 GE and 17 by elections. I have to disagree with you that the EC "remains very fair and transparent"! The last by elections in Sibu we caught on video an EC guy leading ladies onto the stairs to negotiate the sale of postal votes. If you care to scroll back you will catch the youtube. The 3 Bersihs are proof that we need a clean EC. Cheers Ellese.

zorro said...

BackStreetGlutton, that is your perception of the man. I know the man intimately and thus my stand on Zaid.We communicate often, the last time was Thursday over lunch. I was annoyed when he resigned from PKR although I was one of those who told him to abort his race for PKR Deputy President post because of blatant rigging. You are free to think whatever of the man.

Anonymous said...

A lot of senior officers in the ATM are not what they seem to be. many of them are clueless village bums who made it by ass licking their superiors. So till this day the unholy trend of ass licking thrives in the ATM making in possible for goons to be generals!!

Anonymous said...


You raised a valid and very important point.

But the fact that you talk about Zaid Ibrahim in the same breath just draw people away from the seriousness of the issue. Zaid may be your buddy but to me and many others out there, he is a snake who will kiss any hand that offers him power and fame, no matter where that hand had been previously.

Sorry, I don't buy this crap that comes out from Zaid.

sampalee said...

When one promote exclusion Like ABU.which basically a hate label. You sow hatred,you reap hatred.
We vote for the candidate we LOVE and not against candidate we hate. It may sound the same,but it is hell of a difference.Got it

Ellese said...

Me as well. Have first hand experience. But there's too much falsehood here.

Let's establish facts here and concept of postal votes. On postal votes, please note both parties can witness the pre voting process. They have opportunity to see how the votes are being put into envelopes and sent to the postal voters. They have time to object at any time until the postal votes are locked in the bag. This is transparent. No parties including DAP PKR PAS have objected anything during this process. Coz why? Coz its fair and transparent.

Number two is after election process at polling station. Voting bags are locked.the parties. If not they can object. At the polling station they have opportunity to object the tally of the votes. They're entitled to see the nature of postal votes returned. They're entitled to object to funny things. They're entitled to object to miscount. They're entitled to object to interference from others not relevant in the room. The counting is transparent. If you don't like you can object.

Can we agree to the above. Otherwise I'll elaborate further. The objection process is key. Each party is entitled to see all. You must object. It's most unfair you object later after accepting the process. And by the way all have chance to object any sign which they feel unclear and objectionable.

The only part which can be criticized is the voting itself. There are many allegations here including your incidence and some doesn't make sense. Let's get back to the concept. In uk or other developed countries people now have option not to poll on polling day. They can vote by post. When the forms are sent to them they're expected to return them. Now no one ever watches what they do with the votes forms. They can ask for that matter any family member to fill up and vote. Or their dogs as well. So long the form is sent back its not an issue. What's important is every citizen receive their voting forms and the numbers of votes should not be more or equal to the numbers entitled to vote. This is where Malaysians fail to understand.
When votes are sent to our armies for example it's up to them to vote. You've entrusted them with the nation security you must entrust then how they wish to vote. If they ask anyone else to vote for them it's up to them. In fact if they want to throw into dustbin it can also be done.
Now what can't be done is to deny them the voting papers. EC must provide a secured avenue for complains if they don't receive it. The papers must be delivered to them. It doesn't matter how they want to use it but they must receive it. Failing which it's a fundamental breach in electoral process.
Many fail to see this. I'm a proponent of more postal votings. I don't want to queue during the polling day and if I can vote by post, so be it. It's more convenient. But I must have the right to protest if I don't receive my voting papers. I can do anything to my postal forms or even give to my pets to eat it but I must be entitled to the forms. Corallary to this right is then I can send it to a secured postal place/ bag where parties may object if not secured like what it is now. (ps. I've forgotten to mention that pre voting process parties have opportunity to see the postal bag and ensure its secured with seals. It's to be signed by all parties)

What many are objecting to postal votes is because the armies and police don't support them. That's all. This is wrong. EC in the coming election is proposing to require more personnel to vote at the voting place witnessed by all political parties. This is a good improvement. They allow the armies to vote early. And thus less people voting at frontiers. This is what I gather now and it's a very good commendable move. I must admit I've yet to read the regulations but if this is the case EC deserves a pat. Now what else can you complain about?

zorro said... are NOT an UMNO lover for sure!ABU is about the negation of UMNO in the administration of the country. Who is talking about loving your candidate? I whack at his missteps and acknowledge when he does well. No sentiments and muddled semantics.

zorro said...

During the Sibu by election the postal votes, normlly the first result to come in, were still not released at 945pm. Too many excuses and needless impediments surfaced. Fed up we left for the counting centre. It was only after RTM announced the result did the EC officially that Wong Ho Leng won!

I am against early voting by the armed forces. There is no impending invasion! Even if their was our neighbours could finish us before our air force top up their fuel tanks.
They should vote like all on polling day. They have their army and police trucks to ferry every batch. Simple logistics! But then chicanery would have no part in the electoral process, yes?

passion1 said...

It takes a thief to catch a thief.It takes a bigger snake to eat a snake. If BN is clean, the EC should be able to come up with regulations for Postal votes in short notice.
With modern technology, we can view results of international sports, Olympics within minutes after the event is over.
As for Malaysians living abroad, voting can be held in our embassies, witnessed by a neutral body, and the results can be known within minutes.
However, it can be made easier, by confining it to BN or PR, to be added to the national results.

Surendran said...

I refer to the statement by Najib Tun Razak that there are only 9,000 stateless Indians in the country and that Pakatan Rakyat’s estimate of 300,000 is exaggerated. The PM’s statement is a dishonest and disgraceful attempt to play down the number of stateless Malaysians of Indian descent.

The tiny figure of 9,000 is baseless and illogical. The PM is mocking and lying to the Indian community. Absurdly,the PM bases his estimate upon the number of persons who had approached JPN counters during the MyDaftar campaign, which was carried on for just a few weeks last year.

Obviously, the majority of the stateless would have been overlooked during this short campaign! To register the stateless, it is not enough to open extra counters at JPN. In order to resolve the problem, it is necessary to go down to the affected persons throughout the nation and systematically register them. Unfortunately, Najib has not shown the political will or inclination to carry out this exercise and end this great injustice.

The problem of statelessness is shockingly widespread among Malaysian Indians, whether rural or urban. The stateless, are denied proper schooling, employment and access to basic amenities.The problem is also becoming worse as it has become generational, with statelessness passed down to the younger generation.

As a result, thousands of Indian children of school-going age are also prevented from schooling or receive incomplete schooling. A prominent example is the case of 17-year-old B Reshina who faced obstacles in registering for the SPM exam earlier this year.

These stateless Indians were born and have lived in Malaysia all their lives. They are citizens by operation of law. Najib and his government have flagrantly breached the federal constitution by refusing to issue blue ICs to our stateless Malaysians.

Not a single Malaysian should suffer from the problem of statelessness. We call upon Najib and his government to stop denying the enormity of the problem and to end the long suffering of stateless Malaysians immediately.

Tiger said...

I think it's safe to say that for important seats, the polling boxes will not reach the centers.
There are already orders placed for additional polling boxes to be filled with pre-voted ballot slips.
We can omly do our part by voting for the best candidate (or better candidate in most cases) and not respond to any provoking by either side.

Ellese said...

There we go again making false claims. It matters not the time the armies postal votes arrive. All must be tallied. All must use the same postal bag signed off by the parties. All have the right to object. If parties don't object, they cannot then claim otherwise. These are typical ignorant layman who doesn't read the by laws and regulations and been involved in the polling and counting.

I state again. Way forward is that we expand postal votes to all of us. We should be entitled not to queue and vote on the polling day in line with most major/ liberal democracies.

Though there is room for improvement, many are accusing based on bad faith and heresay. They claim they're against Postal voting by armed forces but at the same time want to expand postal votings to Malaysians abroad. Tak masuk akal. If claim fraud, worldwide lagi lah fraud. That's why the claim against postal voting is made in bad faith. You condemn coz you cannot get vote. But ok if you can get vote. These BN and PR have same mentality.

Now I've given the detail explanation and how to improve countering the points given. You zorro don't even acknowledge it. If fair recognize it. Similarly to others. Tell me why it's not transparent and fair. You can't simply condemn saying you don't want postal voting after not being able to counter the points. For goodness sake the world has moved on to early voting for many reasons including mainly convenience for voters. Just see the US presidential elections lah. We should move forward and not backwards. Now because you want to move backwards you say others are wrong. Terrible betul Malaysians Ni.

I put it to you that most who are against postal votings have no good faith in improving the system and talk cock on moral highground. Rubbish. If I hear again you want to have free and fair election I will tell you off again on this point. Why can't we be fair? Susah sangat ke? If we demand fairness on others be fair as well lah.

That's why I think those who claim our electoral process as fraudulent are also as evil as those in UMNO who cannot accept a losing result. They've been unreasonable and think their way is the only right way.They have no intention to build their case legally or go to court. And if unhappy with the result later they have justification to take to the streets to bring down elected government. Then on top of that they pretend to have no such intention and demand their opponents to accept election results.

Man. We're not born yesterday lah.

nkkhoo said...

Yes, who cares about the garbage you write in your website?

Anonymous said...

Hey, Zorro

How did you manage to attract an ostrich chick like Ellese? This person must be on Ecstacy to think that Barisan National follow international rules on voting. Or perhaps this person is a product of BTN.

Anyway, it's been awhile since I read such naivety. Refreshing to know ostriches are abundant in Malaysia too.

zorro said...

Anon256pm, Ellese is pro BN but he has contributed some fair comments. We need to be impartial at times and give way to fair comments. I even let NKKHOO thru. I do this sometimes to humor people looking for recognition.

Ellese said...

Anon 256, I know you dont have anything upstaireattach rebut and thus resorted to name calling and classification. I've met many idiots who simply like to compliment the idiocy of others. Ive added to you the list.

I said elsewhere I defend my honour and reply in similar fashion. First youre a bloody liar. It's typical argument by association. People use this argument to hide their cerebral deficiency. So argue by association saying its BTN lah BN lah whereas none of them have ever argued my point. They think by arguing like that the argument suddenly become wrong. They think others are stupid and can't see this. So Anon it doesn't work anymore. What I put is my own view lah you dumb fool. Its not BN or UMNO. Next time if you dont know don't talk. If believe in something argue lah. Ini resorting to animal name calling. What rubbish.

benhur said...

Ellese, I think you don't know how to

Anonymous said...

Don't you worry brother and we care. rest assure and we do need your support.

zorro said... assured, my support is guaranteed if you care to initiate this forum.

Ellese said...

I think by now I can safely conclude that nobody actually know what our postal voting like and not interested whether it's fair or not and recommend proposal to improve. As I said it, most condemn postal voting of armies coz they don't support you but can accept Malaysian overseas postal voting coz they're perceived to support you. Condemn bn practice but practice the same method. I tell you this two party system which should bring us better politics has brought us the same thing. I now believe that many Malaysians are simply ignorant and malas membaca.

Anonymous said...

Next GE, to many is election of all elections, still it is an election.

Except 1 man, I think he probably take it more personally than the PM himself. It is about legacy lose, how not to be personal about it?

The burden on him is way too big, to face Anwar, Kit Siang, Nik Aziz from the other side of the bench. Too much personal memories of betrayals and sufferings snick into their mind, if they meet. Coming GE he could be the man that lost most sleeps, work much harder than PM himself.

It reminds me to General Coa-Coa (from tales of 3 kingdoms). By the way, general Coa-Coa is famous for character of "I would betray the whole world, but let no one go against me". General Coa-coa was so powerful and fearful to other 2 kingdoms.

What would general coa-coa do if he lose the next GE?